M
maitrekapelo
Banned
Estonia, French
- Apr 8, 2007
- #1
How can I translate in English 'usine à gaz'?
Une "usine à gaz" est une expression récente qui désigne un ensemble de systèmes compliqués qui fait tout et n'importe quoi.
According to wikipedia : En français, l'expression "usine à gaz " est un terme péjoratif, désignant quelque chose de très grand, de très compliqué, voire de très coûteux et dont on a beaucoup parlé, mais ne servant pas ou ne produisant pas grand chose en réalité.
A
archijacq
Senior Member
Albi
french France
- Apr 8, 2007
- #2
top-heavy, unwieldy, slow and impractical: "a Heath Robinson device"/"a kludge".
L
LARSAY
Banned
Hanoi, Vietnam
BI-NATIONAL FRENCH-ENGLISH.
- Apr 9, 2007
- #3
Originally, an "usine à gaz" is the place containing the huge tanks in which gas is stored for distribution to the consumers. Consequently, it is not an "usine" at all, just a storage installation. Hence the use of the expression to speak about something big, looking complicated, costly, but not doing much (in the 50s, it was the name given to the computers of the time, which covered 500m2 and weighed 30 tonnes). SO, if the English text was talking about the
original"usine à gaz", the translation would be "gas storage plant". Now, in the new interpretation, I would suggest "White elephant".
G
Guillaume37
Senior Member
Tours
France / French
- Apr 9, 2007
- #4
The phrase is also used to criticize new boards and commissions that are created and are completely phoney and useless. White elephant and kludge sound perfect.
clairet
Senior Member
England & English (UK version)
- Oct 3, 2007
- #5
Recently I've seen several references to "usine à gaz" where it clearly does not mean a gasworks.
An example to hand: a newspaper headline "Les pharmaciens craignent l'usine à gaz" about opposition to the proposed "franchise" on medecines and which contains this text from the journalist quoting a pharmacist:
"...Mais ceux qui ont des maladies graves...(qui) sont trop pauvres pour pouvoir se soigner normalement..>> Sans compter assure-t-il, qu'il << craint l'usine à gaz!>> Et de se demander sur quel prorata des 9/12 on va calcular le forfait pour une femme enceinte, ..etc"
There's nothing else in the article which helps.
I can barely make a guess: the whole system blowing up?
R
RuK
Senior Member
Outside Paris
English/lives France
- Oct 3, 2007
- #6
A usine à gaz is a Rube Goldberg machine. An unneccessarily complicated creation that functions poorly.
JeanDeSponde
Senior Member
France, Plateau du Vercors
France, Français
- Oct 3, 2007
- #7
Une usine à gaz is a setup, a device, a regulation so complex you can know from the start that it will not work satisfactorily.
J
Jean-Michel Carrère
Senior Member
French from France
- Oct 4, 2007
- #8
Is RuK's suggestion widely understood in the English-speaking world ?
wildan1
Moderando ma non troppo (French-English & CC Mod)
Virginia Piedmont - USA
English - USA
- Oct 4, 2007
- #9
Yes, they are very well known under this name.
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clairet
Senior Member
England & English (UK version)
- Oct 4, 2007
- #10
I think Wildan1's answer applies to AE. I'd never heard of Rube Goldberg and, while RUK obviously has, I doubt many in the UK would have. We'd say "Heath-Robinson machine" (after a well-known, in the UK, cartoonist).
wildan1
Moderando ma non troppo (French-English & CC Mod)
Virginia Piedmont - USA
English - USA
- Oct 4, 2007
- #11
You are correct. Rube Goldberg was a famous US political cartoonist who drew many of these imiginary machines as a way to criticize bureaucracies, etc.
It seems that a similar concept is expressed locally in different ways around the world, according to Wikipedia
--all seemingly inspired by cartoonists.
W
WME
Senior Member
French-France
- Oct 13, 2015
- #12
I have carefully looked into every proposition but I'm not really satisfied. What about "black box" ?
wildan1
Moderando ma non troppo (French-English & CC Mod)
Virginia Piedmont - USA
English - USA
- Oct 13, 2015
- #13
A black box figuratively describes a process that is complex but unclear at this time.
It may need the complexity, however, so calling something a black box simply means it is so far unexplainable. It does not usually carry the criticism usine à gaz carries. I think the other suggestions above are better.
See this discussion of black box: the green economy is a black box
S
Samba05
Member
Hautes-Alpes
English
- Oct 26, 2015
- #14
Good morning the translation world.
I have looked at the other threads on this subject, but have not found what I'm looking for.
This is the heading of a chapter in a book on climatic change.
After the heading the author goes on to explain that that humanity is facing a threat due to the fact that the climatic change does not affect all the regions or countries in the same manner. So as I see it this "usine à gaz" is referring to a complicated situation not an actual factory. But I have no idea how to translate this as "the Heath Robinson/Rube Goldberg machine" as a heading seems a bit strange.
The 2 degrees is referring to the affect a 2 degree drop in global warming could have on the planet.
I'm totally lost and any help would be more than appreciated.
TIA
Linda
cropje_jnr
Senior Member
Canberra, Australia
English - Australia
- Oct 26, 2015
- #15
How about: The complexities of a two-degree global temperature increase (?)
Or: The complex effects...
S
Samba05
Member
Hautes-Alpes
English
- Oct 26, 2015
- #16
Hi cropje_jnr
Thanks so much for the reply and yes I really like your suggestions and they make sense.
Michelvar
Quasimodo (French-English mod)
Marseille
French / France
- Oct 26, 2015
- #17
Hi,
Samba05 said:
So as I see it this "usine à gaz" is referring to a complicated situation not an actual factory
I don't have the text, but, usually, it's not a complicated situation. Usine à gaz is an unnecessarily complicated solution.
So, the text may be about a very complicated solution, made this way because you can't get everyone to act cleverly. As for instance finding companies to give millions to fund the reforestation of poor areas, while the people living there keep cutting trees. This is a "Heath Robinson device" idea, it is more simple to provide energy to the people so that they stop cutting trees. (This is just to explain the idea, not to begin a debate about that )
iuytr
Senior Member
Toulouse
French - France
- Oct 26, 2015
- #18
Usine à gaz is widely used in french, often to characterize administrative processes, for example the fiscal system, or the "code du travail". There is the idea of a complicated situation but also the idea to make more complex than necessary. I have seen "labyrinthine system " as a translation but it is flat, you loose the image. And here , there is also a pun or a reference to gaz à effet de serre.
S
Samba05
Member
Hautes-Alpes
English
- Oct 26, 2015
- #19
labyrinthine efffect???
C
Chimel
Senior Member
Belgium
Français
- Oct 26, 2015
- #20
It's all the more difficult because, as I see it, "l'usine à gaz des deux degrés" is clumsy in French too. I mean: the solutions they imagine to face the two-degree increase may be seen as an "usine à gaz", as in Michelvar's very clear explanation, but not the two degrees as such. I would never write such a heading.
So feel free to take some liberty with the French...
S
Samba05
Member
Hautes-Alpes
English
- Oct 26, 2015
- #21
Hi Chimel,
I get what you saying so do you think my suggestion labyrinthine effect is okay, and perhaps I should leave off the 2 degrees bit?
C
Chimel
Senior Member
Belgium
Français
- Oct 26, 2015
- #22
At first sight, I think it would be an acceptable solution.
Anyway, you have to make a choice: either you focus on the complexity of the 2 degrees problem, or on the complexity of effects, solutions,... and then you leave off the 2 degrees.
J
JAQT
Senior Member
California and NYC
English - American
- Oct 27, 2015
- #23
If the text is referring to an overly complicated solution to the problem, then, to preserve the pun to gaz à effet de serre (if there is one) maybe something like "the red tape over greenhouse gases".
J
Jaykew
Member
Paris, France
French
- Jan 20, 2024
- #24
How about a boondoggle?
Merriam-Webster: “a wasteful or impractical project or activity often involving graft//The project is a complete boondoggle—over budget, behind schedule, and unnecessary.”
I suppose it has the added notion of “graft” (magouilles in French) which the expression “usine à gaz” does not necessarily convey. But in some circumstances it might work.
wildan1
Moderando ma non troppo (French-English & CC Mod)
Virginia Piedmont - USA
English - USA
- Jan 20, 2024
- #25
Jaykew said:
How about a boondoggle?
That describes a project or activity that is not worth its cost -- there is not anything mysterious about a boondoggle, except that it is a waste of time and/or money.
A boondoggle is often used to describe a useless or frivolous trip that is paid for by the employer -- see this previous discussion:
boondoggle (travel)
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